Description:

Well, you know what that means it’s time to expose the money lies. Let’s get started. 

Where are you meeting other entrepreneurs, if you’re not participating in groups, masterminds memberships, or some regular activity, where you meet other entrepreneurs and develop relationships. 

I think you definitely should, because it is great to have that support and those resources. And not only that, to develop those connections and those relationships. Not only are these types of programs, great resources, but they give you the opportunity to expand your Resource Network even further. And what goes way beyond the practical resource benefit is the are the connections that really nourish your soul. So today’s guest I met in a group I got involved in this year, which is coaching Kim’s coaching pods. It’s amazing I highly, highly recommend it.

 

 But this guest, today’s guest is such a delight. She has a dynamic flair for making your kitchen fun and easy. So Sandra Clark Jergensen is a writer, cook and teacher she helps home cooks feel at ease, like a natural in the kitchen through a flexible, approachable style and an emphasis on fresh seasonal food. Every recipe she teaches is something she’s personally written or adapted with you in mind. She’s taught cooking classes for more than 15 years cut coming to the kitchen as an academic, professional and curious bird have a home cook. No matter what your kitchen or life looks like she passionately believes you can cook fantastic, healthy, fresh food in a delicious, delightful and doable way. She believes anyone can cook like a natural starting exactly where they are. So I encourage you to check out Sandra at her website, that kitchen natural calm to learn how you can become a natural in the kitchen. In the meantime, sit back and enjoy this fun conversation with Sandra. Hey, Sandra is so great to have you on the podcast today. Welcome.

Thank you Jill. That’s always nice to chat with a friend.

Yeah, it’s so much fun because I met Sandra, when we were working together in Kim Job’s coaching Kim, I should say, shouldn’t leave out Scott, the coaching pods and so that’s where I met her and she is so much fun. I did a cooking class with her. And she is super engaging, super dynamic. And I love how much she makes cooking in the kitchen feel. Oh, thank you. Yeah, it’s all totally true. So Sandra, I just want to to give my audience a sense of who you are. So I’ve already done a formal introduction of you. So I really want you to talk about who are you really, as a person? You know, what is the most important things we should know about you as Sandra Clark Jergensen.

 

Well, thank you. Okay, so, more than anything, I am a curious bird of a home cook. Yes, I am a cooking teacher and I have a background in cooking and writing. But more than anything, I’m always up for like what will happen what’s possible, and having a really good time in the kitchen because it’s a place to explore and I want that sort of freedom available to everyone that I cook with. So some people learning to cook feels stuffy or formal. Never that way with me because I’m not any of those things.

 So you just bring your whole personality to the kitchen with you. Yes, it’s definitely a full self activity of what excites and delights me and helping other people feel that to have possibilities and fun.

 Yeah, yeah, and that’s exactly what I experienced in the class that I took from you. It was just cuz I felt kinda, I mean I even took some culinary classes and so I became equipped it This was several years ago and so you know, use it or lose it. That whole thing. But, um, you know, coming in to that I kind of felt nervous, and you just put me right at ease. Oh, I’m so glad.

 

So how did you do that? Because I feel like you know the secret of what’s missing for people what makes them nervous in the kitchen, because you were able to dial in that for all of us that attended so quickly and easily.

Yeah, I think people spend a lot of time in their head. And I’m the first person to admit that I’m there too, when it comes to a lot of issues, but in the kitchen, people do that, too. They’re like, ah, I don’t have Africa, I have, like my can is not the exact time that is being demonstrated in this recipe, or I am out of time, or whatever it is, and they feel like I just can’t do this, I give up. And I’m just like, actually, that’s where you begin. Because everything is possible. It’s just making a few tweaks and adjustments to make it your own. So maybe you’re not doing dairy right now. Or maybe your kids allergic to nuts, and the only 9×13 pan in the house just like bottomed out yesterday, you’re gonna be fine. There’s so many workarounds and recognizing that if you decide it’s going to work out, everything is going to be fine. And you’re just working from a different place and recipes. That’s just a formula. Instead of like an ultimatum, it must be drawn this way. Why else? Why else are there 17 recipe 70 million recipes for like a pan of brownies, there isn’t one way to do it. People are making these things with black beans, people are making these things with like all butter and like cocoa powder. Some people are making them with whatever. The point is just like there’s so many ways to get to it. 

 

It’s an experiment. I love that. Yeah. And so it’s interesting to kind of look at this and tie it back to business because, you know, coaches that are building a business, which is who I coach and who I help. They are so in their heads about, oh, I need to do this right, I need to follow the formula. And it’s so easy to forget that it’s all an experiment, because we’re all doing what we need to do for the business we want for let as you said, for the brownie brownie recipe we want you know, if if we’re not doing dairy, then why are we going to make brownies with Darien? Right? If that’s not our formula, then that’s okay. What are some of the stories that they come with?

 

Sure a lot of people come with the story of I should be doing it this way. Or it’s hard or it’s complicated. I’m just thinking of clients I’ve worked with who they want to do things differently than they were raised for themselves or for their kids, or whatever it is. And they’re just like, the process of getting from A to B feels really, really complicated and super heavy, especially when you have a cultural tradition, or a social norm that is different than what you want to do if you are coming out of like meat and potatoes being raised with like on food like that. And you’re like I want to eat more colorfully but like you look at that bunch of kale at the store, and you’re just like, I don’t know what to do with you. You look scary. You get in your head. And it makes it so much harder than the actual process of, you know, cooking with the kale.

Let’s take a couple of examples. So Sure. So if, if if somebody is trying to cook cook from scratch, if they’re trying to be, say gluten free? That seems like a tough to me, that seems like a tough one, because I haven’t ever done that before. So if I suddenly am trying to cook for someone who is gluten free, what are the things that I’m going on? What are some of the things I need to think about? Or how do I think about that in a way that it’s not super scary or it doesn’t feel limiting?

 

First of all, it’s a lot harder to learn how to make biscuits gluten free than it is to just make a rice dish that is naturally gluten free. So start yourself off easy. And yes, you can make phenomenal gluten free biscuit. I do it. But doesn’t mean you have to like jump off the deep end. That feels approachable.

 

I like that. Yeah. So break it down. Like what can you do? Yeah, that’s the same thing that I tell a lot of my clients they like but I can’t. And so the first thing I ask them is what can you do? So I like that because that’s kind of the approach that it sounds like Yeah. Don’t start with the hardest thing that you can imagine start with what feels easy.

 

Yes. I mean, that makes it like so much more accessible because I’ve worked with people at a variety of levels where some folks are brand new cooks and other folks, you know, have been quite experienced that they have a few things they would like to learn. And so the point is, I teach and not everyone knows this, I teach the exact same recipes no matter who I hang out with, that I’ve written. And it’s just making them accessible at different levels, because some people are going to go to the farmers market and buy that lovely head of butter lettuce, and go home and wash it and use that. And for some people, just buying that bag of lettuce at the grocery store is a new experience. Start there. Or maybe you’re using food stamps, or whatever it is, and you’re going to buy what works for that. Everyone’s got where they are. And starting right there is the perfect place to start. Because that’s where you are.

 

Hmm. You sound just like a coach with food. Yeah, you’re a food kitchen cooking coach. Yeah, yeah. So I mean, it does sound like a very similar approach that we take in coaching. And, I mean, we just we just meet our clients where we are, and that’s exactly what you’re doing. And you make it so much fun. I mean, I know I’ve said that, like three times, but I know I don’t think of myself as fun. So I love to hang out with people who are you’re very fun. Fun. Yes. Um, so and and it sounds like another thing that I find with my clients is that they don’t trust themselves with their business decisions or their decisions about money. And I know that I’ve heard you talk before about the same thing kind of concept in the kitchen, you have to really learn to trust yourself to tell me tell me a little bit about that.

 

Oh, that one hits me like so deep. Because I remember being there and non trusting myself with whether it was like money decisions and starting my own business, or maybe being a very young cook. And for the first time where I would start edging out from basic recipes, and I would start to pick them apart saying I don’t know if this will come out. And then just doing it any way. And so I want people to recognize that the best authority or what is delicious. And what will work in your kitchen is actually you. It is not the like recipe developer or the cookbook author, it is not the blogger on the internet, because the blogger on the internet doesn’t know that you hate nutmeg. And the blogger on the internet doesn’t know that your oven like is always hot on this particular burner. And the blogger on the internet just doesn’t know you and the way that you like your food salted. And the fact that you know you have a lemon tree outside, and everything tastes better to you with a little bit of lemon.

 

Oh, yeah, that that’s so good. Because same thing, you know, it goes back to our business. You know, because nobody is going to build a business the way that you’re going to build your business. Because you know what you want your business to look like? And nobody else has that vision, except for you. Except to the extent that you shared it with your team or with the people that you’re working closely with. 

 

So yeah, can I give you a quick example that my heart explode? Last night I was teaching my teen cooking club I’ve got a group of teenagers and tweens who we come together on Tuesday nights, and do a cook a long dinner class where they make dinner for their family, whatever. We’re making rice pudding last night as the finish for the meal and the kids are starting to ask all these questions. Well, could I do this? Is this okay? I really like these flavors. I’m not sure about what we’re doing. And I’m just like, I am so delighted that you were asking all of these questions because you’re asking these questions because you are aware that you want something you are aware of what you like, the only thing is now to try it and to like own that you are the best person to decide what’s good for you. And as laughing as the kids are coming up with all these suggestions and possibilities to make the rice pudding theirs. I was like well would it work with Carmel if I liked Carmel I’m like, do you like Carmel? Do you like rice pudding and Carmel flavors together? The best way to know is get out a spoon and try that one sister and to watch them like oh yeah, I do know what I like that. Just to kind of own that in a way that like, I am free to create anything within the rice pudding universe was so fun. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, the three takeaways I have from that is know what you want. No. Be willing to experiment to get it and be wrong. Okay, and be willing to be wrong. Yeah. So just do it is basically what you’re saying. Just Yeah, sure. There’s some fundamentals that will make it easier to be successful. But at the end of the day, you are the best person? Yeah. Yeah, that’s so much more fun to write.

Yeah, it totally is when you realize that all of the tools are right there for you.

 

So we talked a little bit about before we got on, you know, some of the I call them money lies, but you maybe you would call them cooking lies? Oh, yeah. And, I mean, they sound exactly like some of the money lies, it’s hard. It’s complicated. They think that about money, I don’t know how it won’t work for me because, or I’ve always done it this way. Or, I can’t change, or it’s too late to learn. So I mean, I know the the one approach is just try it. But, um, but where have you seen that come into play? for your students, it is so fun to look at, like in terms of lies, because then it gets salacious. And you recognize, like, yeah, these are high drama and not really based in reality, if you really unpack them, saying that it’s hard or complicated, or I don’t know how just feels like head spin, and instead jump dropping into laughs starting and slowly unpacking those. It’s like, our brains want to do the easy thing always.

 

 And the easy thing is like thinking like, just sticking to what I know. And then feeling terrible about wanting something else. Oh, and feeling like we don’t know how, when the truth is, it’s like these ruts of frustration of like, cooking dry chicken every single time and then feeling bad, or like relying on pie crust from a can, which is fine, if you’re happy with your reasons for it. But feeling like I want to do something different or cooking the same dish, five dishes on repeat. I just had a one on one class where someone who had been making dry chicken, her entire adult put, and bless her heart felt terrible about it. She’s a good cook in other ways. But this just kept coming up for her. And she said, I just want to fix this. And so after feeling terrible, and like it’s complicated, it’s hard. I can’t for like 25 years, we sat down and did a one on one class for just like 90 minutes. And she came out of the class with two like techniques for cooking chicken. That was just butter. And it was remarkable how I changed everything about the way that she felt. And all of those things that she had told herself all that high drama. She recognized that wasn’t ever the easy thing. The easy thing was sitting down with someone who could help her and completely changing her own world and what she thought was possible. Yeah, so finding the expert, and getting help asking for help. I mean, how simple is that?

 

Yeah, an expert that helps you do you? Because we went through and we made it the flavors that she wanted rather than me saying this is the only way to do it, sister is what would you like, let me help you get it?

 

Yeah, I love it. I love it. What would what would you like and let me help you get it,

which is what you totally do with people with money, you’re another kind of delight. And so how do you help them? What are some other ways that you help them get out of their head and into the kitchen?

 

Probably is just doing the thing. Cook along classes are really really powerful, which is the funniest thing I learned over the pandemic I mostly been teaching in person. And that was fun and that was entertaining and you get to come see the song and dance and maybe you’ll have a finger too and and participate but mostly you know, you might be there, drinking your beverage and enjoy During the party, but once the pandemic, I was suddenly teaching virtual classes where everyone was actually in their very own kitchen, and doing the actual work themselves, and so they got to participate in a whole new way. And it became the impact of what I saw possible in the classes as people went, they changed their skills super rapidly, because they were cooking along in real time in their real kitchen, and we were solving problems together, because they really like, Sandra, I don’t have this thing, what am I going to do, or you know, I watched someone light something on fire in class once and just calmly say, just put a lid on it, it’s going to be okay. And just watching that impact of really going from all of the lies that they were telling themselves and what wasn’t possible, to really just cooking, working in the kitchen, cooking in the kitchen, experimenting in the kitchen, is about problem solving.

 

Yes. And honestly, recognizing if you have a guide there to help you with things that seemed esoteric before, like, how many recipes Have you read that just say, keep the pan or saute until done? And what does that actually mean? to have someone to be like, you’re doing it right? You’re doing it right? don’t flip that yet. Now, you’re good. Someone just to say you’re doing a great job, or trust yourself a little bit more and give you the tools of what to look for to be more attuned to success, that know when you’re there and help you tweak it up a notch.

 

Yeah, I love one of the things that I’ve heard you say, which is talking about playing with your husband never grown up in that regard. Oh, boy. So how if somebody doesn’t feel very creative in the kitchen, what would be one step that they can take to sort of foster their creativity in that area?

 

Sure. Pick one thing, pick one thing and stop putting everything on yourself of looking at like some dish in a restaurant that you are obsessed with, and what you’re currently cooking, and just pick one thing to change, say maybe you decide, October is the month I feel free with herbs, I am just going to spend like an extra like three to six bucks a week, I’m going to buy that fresh bunch of herbs. And if you really want a hot tip, get the poultry mix that comes with like three to four herbs in the same package for the same price. And then you’ll get like sage and rosemary and parsley and time, all together. And then just start playing with those, chop them up and put them in your salad dressing. Like toss them over like the salmon that you just seared. Or maybe you’re going to take a leaf of that stage. And when you brew yourself a mug of tea, you’re going to have the stage in there and it’s going to infuse in through with the tea. You can have so much fun if you just say I’m only doing one thing, everything else the same. But I’m going to play with herbs this month $20 investment on Baptists.

 

Wow, what a great idea. So what do you have coming up? In October? For for your clients for your students? Yes, so I am looking forward to I’m teaching a free class, October 14, we’re going to be talking about seasonal flavors. And then we how to make yourself a killer toast. If you have ever seen like those beautiful toasts that they have in restaurants that cost $14 Let me show you how to make a beautiful one with even better flavors for a lot less.

 

And then seeing that on your Instagram.I’m kind of obsessed with toast if anyone follows my Instagram, you’ll be like this is a part time post account and that is true.

Oh, I love it. So where can they find information on this free class? Okay, everything is going to be linked through my Instagram profile or Facebook and just go to the kitchen natural comm backslash free class. And that’s where we’ll be hiding out. Well that answers super fun.

 

Yeah, so one thing that I haven’t announced that is that you’re coming to my elevate retreat, and I’m super excited about that, because it’s gonna be so much fun. You’re going to be there you’re going to be part of the time participating in the retreat and part of that time actually sharing some of these juicy tips and tidbits And some really great food. And so we’re not really excited about we are cooking the food together, it’s going to be gold. Yeah, so what made you probably putting you on the spot a little bit here, but what made you interested in coming to the retreat?

 

Jill, you don’t do things half way, you go all out even like, as you know, almost coming up on a year that I’ve known you, your advice is like, so thought out and sage and beautiful and kind. And anytime I’ve watched you launching anything, it is so kind and thoughtful and so inclusive, that when you do things, you invite people and you take care of them, and you care about them. And so anywhere that you are, is a place that I want to be because of the way you show up for people.

 

Ah, thank you so much. I did not pay her to say that. But I really do accept it later. That day, just amazing. It’s going to be a beautiful event. Oh, yeah, I can’t wait. And I can’t wait to actually meet you in person. That’s gonna be so much fun. I hope you are a hugger.

 

I am definitely up for it. Okay. So one thing I asked every one of my podcast guests, actually two questions. And the first one is what is a money lie that you had in your business? Oh, my goodness, all of them. Or just one? Mine was probably like, I don’t know how I don’t know how I don’t know how, or looking at other people and feeling like I can’t do it their way.

 

Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, and that’s so common for a lot of my clients. The same thing. And, and what amazes me is that I’ve been watching you for this past year, so that we know each other, and you make it look so easy. So how did you get because I know that my audience is probably gonna, you know, be curious. Well, how did she get past that? Right? Because you do you make it? Look, I think you make it look so easy. So how did you get from? Oh, my gosh, I don’t know how I don’t know how I don’t know how to just doing it and getting it done pretty well. Because you’re you’ve been seeing some pretty tremendous success in your business. So congratulations. Yeah.

 

Honestly, it was leaning into what lit me up. Because anytime I compared myself to other people, I was just I felt terrible. And I wasn’t getting where I wanted to go. But when I leaned into the things that like drove my heart, and I was delighted about most, it felt easier somehow, because I stopped paying attention to it should look this way. Instead of like, I am so happy doing these things.

 

Great. Yeah. So I guess from here, it’s just turning the volume up. I am working on that one for sure. Because I’m just getting over the fact of like, I am not like a professionally trained culinary school. Chef, I am self taught. And I am all of these things. And those are actually my strengths is because I think like a home cook, instead of like someone who has been to culinary school.

Oh, yeah. So that makes you? Uh huh. Yeah, understand where they’re coming from, and be able to solve their problems so much easier. So. So for you out there listening, if you see something as a weakness, see how you can turn that around to a strike to help your clients just like Sandra is doing.

 

Yeah, it felt so heartening to recognize like, actually, that thing that I was felt really sheepish about is actually the greatest thing that I can offer all of my clients is that I get through the same exact stuff. I have been exactly where you are. And I think the same way you do. Because at the end of the day, I’m a home cook to also cooking for a family who has feelings about food and ghee and all of this stuff.

 

Yeah, it’s so interesting to see that that was just a money lie. I know. Wasn’t the truth even though it probably felt like it at the time. Like it is hard. See, it is hard. Yeah, I don’t know how see that. The truth? Yeah. Yeah. And that was just, you know, a giant lie just to say, actually, it doesn’t matter. And actually, this is the thing that sets me apart and makes me me. No, I love it. So last question, What’s your favorite thing to think about money, or to think about making money in your business?

 

Okay, so the thing that I think about making money is that I love it when I see results, not necessarily as dollar signs, but as like value that feels really deep in my core that I love pouring value into everything I do. Because it’s not enough for me to teach you how to make that chicken, I also want to tell you five different ways that you can change it up and make it yours. I also want to like, think into knowing who you are, and making it applicable to you. It’s so much less about, I move so much further investor when I don’t think about the dollar signs, but I think about value. Because money can feel sticky, but value feels easy.

Ah, yeah. So what does value mean to you? I mean that you kind of started to go into that. But like, if you could help people wrap their mind a little bit around value, what? What do you mean, when you say value is easy.

It’s easier to charge. What my products or my teaching people is worth, when I recognize like the client that I worked with making the chicken that she had gone 25 years making dry chicken and feeling like sheepish about it, and it was a family joke. And then the value of her never feeling that way again, and making perfect chicken on demand for the rest of her life. There’s like, Yeah, that one was worth it. And it’s easy for me to say, Yeah, I can charge what I’m worth, because I am taking that value. And I am poring over for my clients and the people that I work with. Because the value is something that goes beyond the, you know, the cost of a session, the cost of a recipe book that I have. It’s something that goes so far and has this endless reach, because maybe you’re going to teach those things to your niece or your kids or yourself to. Yeah, super duper fun when you think about that. And you’re like, yeah, yeah, we can do this.

 

So the value you gave her was was freedom.Yes, I love that of putting it way. That way, because she felt so tight about her cooking. And then all of a sudden, by the end of the session, just like joyful and freedom, because how much more was possible that she didn’t recognize before.

 

When I mean, all of that just opens up so many more possibilities when you feel free versus constricted, right, which is I imagine, like I know, when I feel kind of sheepish about certain things, or, you know, I just, I’m not as open to try new things. But when I am open to try new things, I discover so many more possibilities for myself. So

 

yeah, freedom feels like love and another coach friend of mine, got me into playing myself love songs. To really get happy and on the one I was listening to this morning was like Peter Townsend. Let my love open the door. And I love the idea. Yeah, right. Finding that love and freedom for yourself in the kitchen and recognizing it, it’s going to open the door to so many more possibilities and that applies to money to of finding love within it instead of the constructions.

 

Yeah, that is such a great note to end.Now go listen to the song. It’s Yeah, that’s exactly what I’m gonna do. Thank you so much, Sandra, and I’m looking forward to seeing you in a couple of weeks. Yes, it’s gonna be delightful and delicious.

 

I love how Santa talks about the recipe being just a formula because there are a million ways to do it. Right? It’s the same with your business, whether you’re making the brownies with black beans or butter and cocoa powder. It’s not wrong, and it’s the right way for you because that’s how you want it however you’re building your business. It’s okay. And then I like how she talked about when you’re doing something new start small, like with the gluten free, she said

 

You know the example she gave us if you’re trying to cook for someone who has eats gluten free, you don’t have to start with gluten free biscuits. Start with something easy, like foods that are naturally gluten free. And that makes so many so much sense. Because so many things in our business are new. And we’re constantly judging ourselves for not getting there fast enough. So you don’t have to start with the hardest thing. And why make things hard, if they can be easy, at least when you’re first learning something new. And then you can always work your way up, you can always go farther and go faster when you go, and go purposefully. And one other thing, one last thing I wanted to kind of highlight is I thought it was great that she talked about how she works with people at a variety of levels, because I do that too. And I see all different levels and I apply the same concepts to wherever you’re at, in so she does the same thing with her students. It’s just making it accessible at different levels. And what we like to do as entrepreneurs, and probably in the kitchen is compare ourselves with people who are at different levels than we are and then judge ourselves for not being where they are. And that limits us not only in our business but in the kitchen. You know, we’re not Julia Child. So it doesn’t it’s, it’s doesn’t really make sense for us to compare ourselves to her and then to then judge ourselves for that. 

 

So if you want freedom, you need to start accepting where you are, and then moving forward from there. So wasn’t that so much fun, I just love her. And she’s coming to my retreat in a couple of weeks. She’s going to join in on the fun, but she’s also going to be showing off her stuff by teaching at dinner a couple of nights. I am super excited about that because I have been in one of her cooking classes. And she just makes things so easy and so fun. And I can’t wait to see what she’s going to share with our guests at the retreat. But again, check out Sandra at the Kitchen Natural calm and on Instagram at the Kitchen Natural. so jealous of her Instagram feed her food pictures are absolutely to die for, you’ll have to check it out. I love it. Sandra has lots of resources and some fun ways to work with her from her recipes, to private coaching, even to cooking classes, both in person and virtual. And she does this for adults and younger folks, her favorite people to teach are teenagers, which is perfect because then if you teach your teenager, to How To Cook, they can help you out and cook for you. And they have so much fun doing it especially the way Sandra does it. 

 

So speaking of my retreat, as of the time I’m recording this, there are still spots available. And I’ve added an option for people who want to come but don’t need a room. And so this is designed for anyone local. I don’t know why I didn’t think about this before, I guess because I was just so looking forward to the time we get to spend in the evenings and in the mornings when you’re staying at the venue. But you know, you can still make it work. If you’re local and you want to be able to go home and sleep in your own bed. That option is $1200 in you can check it out at https://jillwrightcoaching.com/elevate-retreat. Now when you go in to sign up, you’re going to go ahead and click the sign up button. And then you’re going to go to go through a couple of questions. Those are going to ask you you know about the room and about you know, dietary restrictions and all of that sort of thing. But if you’re doing the local version for $1200 just make sure that you pick that version in the options for the room. And then when you go to checkout, just make sure that you put in the promo, promo code no hotel and NOHOTEL. And that will give you that should give you the $1200 price. Any questions at all any trouble getting through that checkout? Just contact me directly at Jill@jillwrightcoaching.com/ I look forward to seeing you at the retreat or on the next podcast.