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Show Notes

What are you doing your way?

What are the results you’ve gotten when you haven’t done it your way?

This conversation with Caryn Gillen, host of the podcast “When I’m in charge, that’ll be different”, was the kind of conversation I love to have with other coaches. I love hearing about the journey that brought them where they are today and the advice they share to make things easier for coaches coming up behind them. 

New From Caryn!! 
“I have re-listed my business course for coaches at $197 and want everyone to have access to it.  

It’s amazing, has everything I did to get to multiple six-figures WITHOUT ads, and it’s super inspiring.”

Get her course now – CLICK HERE

Listen to the show



Welcome to Easy money. I’m Jill the Money Coach. I know what it’s like to push through to white knuckle it to put in the time and get no results. I know what it’s like to wonder what’s the right way, and to constantly worry about doing it all wrong. I’ve learned a whole lot from doing things the hard way. That’s why I help coaches go from doing everything the hard way to making money easy. You want to create your dream life and dream business that’s all about being free to do what you want. Spend what you want, and build the future you want and do it all with ease. In this podcast, I bring you Simple Strategies for Success for your business that make money easy. So it’s time for easy money. Are you ready? Well, then let’s go. 

Oh, my goodness. Have I got a treat for you today. I am so excited about the conversation I get to share on this episode with one of the coaches I’ve had the pleasure to work with. Caryn  Gillen is a Master Certified Life Coach, who holds multiple certifications, and a master’s degree in counseling psychology. Her experience includes commercial fishing, family business, project management, restaurant service and management and the hotel management side of small ship cruising. Lots of variety there. I love it. She has been concerned with revenue generation and client services since before she can remember her earliest work being a lemonade stand, sweeping the floor at her dad’s shop and performing traditional Norwegian folk dances for tourists who made it to Alaska, this little Norway. Caryn loves and coaches two distinct groups of people; she mentors fellow life coaches who are moving into their identity as business leaders. And she is a mindset coach for founders and execs who have had all the success they initially dreamed of, and are now asking, Hey, what’s next? So enjoy this conversation with Caryn, it’s always such a pleasure to have a conversation with her. She’s a thinker like I am. So I love that part of it. I love collaborating with other thinkers and other questioner. So enjoy this conversation. 

Well, I am so glad you’re here, Caryn, it is always such a pleasure to talk to you. Because I love the questions that you ask your, your a question person kind of like I am. And so I am always blown away by the questions that you come up with. And so I love having conversations with you. Because I always leave going, huh? What just happened? Yeah, I love it. Yeah. And, you know, just for context, because in case something comes up that we coached on, which is fine, I’m kind of an open book. So if something does come up, you coached me for six months. And it was an incredible experience. And I just appreciate your vibe and your energy so much. I love how you show up for your clients. And so giving and, and open, and it was such a good experience. So it’s just Oh, thank god out there to start with.

That’s the best testimonial ever. Thank you. I appreciate it. And how awesome to get to be with an open book too, because it makes it easier for me. Yeah, yeah, there’s, I don’t feel like there’s any topics we have to avoid. It makes life so much easier when you’re like, Wait a second. Do I, can I talk about that? Okay, so we get to talk about anything and everything I meet. Yeah, yeah. So yeah. Did you Is there anything that you want to share outside of? You know, because I always share the official bio, but I also like for people just to know a little bit about the person. So is there anything you want to share about yourself that you feel is interesting or that people maybe don’t know about you?


That’s fun, because I think every time someone asks us this question, we find out something new, or at least that’s true for me. And when you asked it at first, I was like that I’m a partner. Like I truly I’m a partner alongside people with the journeys that they’re on, whether that was when I was a commercial fisherman, I came together and partnered with the captain about like, how are we going to do this thing? Right? Or in restaurants or in coaching? Working with founders, mentoring coaches, like it’s all? I’m going to partner with you for whatever it is, you’re here to do. Let’s go.

I love that. Yeah, I just feel the same way about my clients. It’s like, I, I mean, I really do agree with Brooke Burke CO. On the, when she said, when I first heard her say, I cannot possibly know what’s best for you. But I can help you tap into what you know, because I think that’s the biggest block in our brain. And that’s why I feel like questions are so important. And that’s exactly why I hired you, because I knew you asked powerful questions. And I felt like at that point in my business, that was exactly what I needed. Now, one thing that I love about you is that you do have a rich background in entrepreneurship. You know, you come from a long line of business owners. And for a long time, I thought, oh, man, if only I could have had that rich history in that experience. But then as I was thinking about this, leading up to our conversation, I thought, you know, I see that as such a positive, but I can see how that might. Also, you can turn that around, and it could actually go either way. Because that could put a lot of pressure on you. It could be like, Oh, my gosh, I have to live up to this, you know, that all these other people did? Or do I have to do it like they do? They did? Or I have to do it. Right. Which, you know, a lot of a lot of your clients and I know a lot of my clients kind of think that same way I have to do it right? And what if I mess up and they deal with all this pressure they put on themselves?

Yeah. So what comes up for me in that is that if you were raised in a family of people who work for other people, it can take you from being a child in school to being an adult acting like you’re in school. Because tell me more. So I’m still I’m going to try to get A’s I’m going to try to please the teacher, you can keep that pattern going for your entire career if you want to. I think the pattern interruption that can happen if you’re a kid raised around people who make their own way and make up their own future is that you, you see that, like it’s all made up. And that you just decide one day to do something, and then you can do that thing. And so in some ways, it’s like, as an 18 year old or even a 12 year old, whatever it is, knowing that it’s all made up. And the big people just decide what they’re gonna do is a different way to walk through the world than thinking like, there’s somebody out there who’s gonna say what’s best for me. And then I’m good. Like, we have to decide that we’re good when we’re our own bosses. And so it’s a big, I mean, anything can be positive or negative. It’s just definitely a different way to look at the world.

Yeah, I love that. I’m still in that thought for sure. Okay, it’s all made up anyway.

It’s all made up, every single thing, every law, every speed limit, how birthday parties work, everything was made up by a human being at some point. And they may or may not have understood how amazing we were going to be. How capable we are like, they didn’t know what was coming. I can’t when I look at my seven year old right now, I’m like, the world that I lived in when I was seven was almost unrecognizable to the world that she lives in as a seven year old. Think of it like just technology alone? It’s incredible.

Yeah, yeah, Freedom just keeps expanding it. It’s all a matter of are you going to take that freedom and experience the freedom capitalize on the freedom take advantage of the freedom or are you going to use that freedom to put yourself in a box? It’s entirely what it seems like a lot of people do.

And the edges are all made up. They’re just decisions that somebody made you somebody else, whatever, like we all and we all have like, and I think that’s what we get to do as coaches. It’s like it’s this continual unboxing, well what’s here now? Like, where’s that corner now? Does it still exist?

Yeah. And this has been such a conscious journey for me over the past. I guess. Not quite a year. But yeah, going through this journey of, because I came to this realization sometime last year. And this sounds pretty obvious, but I really stopped and realized, oh my gosh, what is going to make me successful? Is everything that I don’t like about myself. Oh, shoot, like, that’s like, oh my gosh, that is so crazy to break that down. What does that even mean?

Yeah, it was like, all of the things that I saw, as that I’ve always, you know, always meaning like most of my life, has seen as my liabilities, I started to see as advantages as things that set me apart as strengths of mine that I could use to help other people. And that’s when, like, my mind was blown. Yeah. And so I, I’ve really did step start to step into the belief that I chose at that time, which was and I and I continue to live into now is being 100% you is exactly what’s going to make you 100% successful. Yeah. And so I started to go on that journey for myself, because what I realized when I, when I was gonna write about it, and so I started this book, and I’m still working on it. I’m gonna release it sometime between now and fall. And it was it was this journey that I started to go on living into that belief. And what I realized when I started to write about it, is, wait a second, okay, so I get that I need to become more me to become more successful. But what does that mean? How do I become more me? And that’s when I realized, oh, I need to learn more about me. And so I’ve been learning about human design. I’d love that podcast that you did with Jackie, a few episodes ago. That was also a good one. Yeah, I love that podcast. It’s so yeah, I’ve been learning about human design, Clifton, 34, strings. You know, I’ve finally figured out my Enneagram type, and not to say 30. Yeah, and, and I think what a lot of people do is they, again, put themselves back in that box using these tools. But those tools, in my opinion, are meant to take you out of the box that you’ve built for yourself. And, and so making sure that we don’t don’t stop ourselves, you know, or limit ourselves. I guess, if you are using tools, and you end up feeling more limited, then, you know, maybe you want to look at how you’re using that tool, because tools are meant to make us feel more free. And we can weaponize anything. Right. That’s if that’s where we’re coming from fabricate new edges. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, have you found that the more I tap into who I am and walk that path, there’s less resistance and more momentum but also more courage required? It’s easier and harder at the same time.

Exactly. Yeah, it’s like, I, I think about if we, all we do in our life is work on releasing the drag. So the stories are, hold us back. Like let’s like take all the anchors off. Take all the hooks out of yourself. Be who we really are like that’s a part of it. And you’re like, Okay, this is who I am. And then to really let yourself be who you are comes with a great amount of ease and flow, but also taps into your like own terror. Yeah, the world will see you, that people will know who you are. That the Yeah, I think it’s like terrifying and scary and exhilarating. And that’s where like, things can really build.

Yes, absolutely. Yeah. Because what’s easier than just being yourself? Other, you know, when you handle what’s harder when you have the courage to do that, because you don’t have to think about, oh, what should I do? Well, you, the you that you truly are already knows the answer to that. So from that perspective, it makes things so much easier. And I love that you talked about releasing the drag, because this is, this is exactly what my retreat is going to be about this year, is “Master Your Story”. Because the stories that we buy into about ourselves, about the world about making money about building a business, right, we have stories about all of that stuff. And that’s exactly like I felt like my stories once I identified them as stories were felt like they were dragging me down. And then like I was carrying this. Dragging this big, heavy sandbag, right, trying to go my business. I’m like, Oh, my gosh, this is so hard. But once I started breaking those stories down, which you helped, you’ve helped me with Dave Moreno has helped me with you know, some of the people I’ve coached with have helped me with this. It’s a team effort. It takes a village takes a village to build a business. Once I started rebuilding some of those stories, and started stepping into like, who I really am have stories that that free me to do the things that I know I’m made to do, then that starts to, like, get started to give me energy back because I’m not dragging that sandbag behind me. So I love that you went there, because that was totally orchestrated. But yeah, so anyway, yeah.

But it’s so cool to think about too, for most of us. We have this calling like for you, you’re here to be of service. It’s like so clear. It’s who you are. It comes out in what you do in the most powerful moments of your work, you’re probably being of service, right? Yes. And then we go to build our businesses. And then we get all this junk built up. That’s all about us. Right? And so there’s all this BS, clouding the fact that I came here to be of service. And it’s how so we put all this stuff on us. Other people put it on a society puts it on, it’s coming in from all directions, yes, everywhere. And then it’s like, Oh, right. At the end of the day, the reason I came here are these pure and good intentions. And I need to use that knife to like slice through all of that cloudiness as often as possible without judgment of myself that the clouds appear every day. Yes, yeah. It’s part of the job. It’s like it needs to be on the calendar, cut through the BS get to service from 8:30 to 11:00. Start serving.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Oh, so good. Um, yeah. So one of the things that, that I think, is that that you teach is? Well, I mean, your podcast is When I’m in Charge. So obviously, that, like, when I’m in charge, this is the way that I’m going to do it. Because, again, this is who I am. And this is what I believe, and this is what I value. But, you know, to get back to that, that topic of courage, I mean, that doing it your own way requires a lot of courage. And yeah, I mean, I feel fortunate that I have always had a strong identity. Just I, in my top 34 strengths, belief is in definitely in the top 10. I think it might be number six. Cool. And, and then I also have, you know, in my human design, my heart center is defined. And so I feel like that’s something that comes pretty naturally to me, it feels fairly easy for me to stay in alignment, because I would rather do it my way in Be Me, although there’s a caveat to that. There’s an asterisk. With that. I would rather do it my way. and fail, then be out of alignment and succeed. Yeah. Which is something, which is something I really struggled with in my corporate career, you know, is not probably, they don’t care about your values, they have their own values.

Exactly, exactly. And I really struggled, that was a huge energy drain for me. Because it, I had this belief and and so even as I was building my business, I still had this, this belief was, it’s a problem that I am the way I am. Because I can’t do it my way and succeed. And so it’s such a problem that there’s the belief that any human being can be a problem. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Because if we didn’t believe that, as a collective, we wouldn’t think that individually. We have this capacity for holding space for the idea that there are people out there who are quote, unquote, problems. Yeah. That means we get to be problems. Yeah, we’re not problems. We’re humans. Do we challenge each other? I hope so. Yeah. Yeah. But like, what about No one’s a problem?

Yeah. And I do truly believe that. And I think I think I have believed that for a really long time. But I think sometimes what we believe about other people is not always easy to believe about ourselves. Right? And so that’s the asterisk. Right? I thought I was being me. But at the same time, I was thinking that who I am is a problem. And so I wouldn’t always act like me. I wasn’t always I didn’t always feel free to show up as me. And so I did a lot of hiding and, you know, was in actively invisible for a long time, for a lot of my life. Yeah. I wasn’t always that way. I mean, when I was a kid, I wasn’t that way. But at some points, I became a problem. And then I became invisible.

When you think about like, all the roles, if anyone’s struggling to feel what we’re talking about, it’s like, we have all these roles, you can identify daughter, sister, mother, wife, white lady, like, whatever the roles are, that we all have. And then there’s society’s idea about the roles and the constriction that that creates. So there’s a natural constriction that’s on us just the second we were born into the roles that we have and the identities that we have. So there’s all of that, which we do live in. And then there’s all the stuff on top of that, which we pick up along the way, and that we create for ourselves in our minds. And we all have, you know, different suitcases we carry, or we came with. Yeah, it’s work. It’s real work.

Yeah. suitcases, we came with suitcases we’ve picked up along the way. The shop were ours didn’t ever belong to us. Right? Stop carrying everybody else’s luggage, we all have enough of our own.

Yeah, so if I have a strong identity, and I struggled to do it my way, I can only imagine how tough it might be for someone who doesn’t have that strong belief. Right? Or that strong identity center? Who, maybe yeah, and then there’s just so much more permeability, about how things should happen should quote unquote, which, right isn’t the way anything works. So this makes me think about business building and like, you go out there. And if you don’t have a strong sense of what your values are, and how you want to do business, then you’re going to think everything you hear is the thing to do. And then you’re going to remember all these things you should be doing but aren’t doing and then you can add judgment on top of that. So I mean, I think one of the not even it is fun, but it also has to be done is excavating like, what have I put in my brain, turned it into a rule and made myself wrong for not doing it, or what have I taken turned into a rule? Do it and it actually goes against my own values for how I want to show up in the world. Because those those both feel really uncomfortable. Yeah. Yeah. What do I do that so Good again?  

What are all the things we’ve taken on? So think of us as coaches, right? Yeah. So we become coaches, we love coaching. And then we’re like, Oh, crap, I have to have a business. Not me. I was like, I want a business, what’s it gonna be? But then it’s how do I go out into the world and learn how to discern between what’s for me and what’s not for me? What’s for right now and what’s not for right now. Because if I don’t have good, a good sense of guardrails, and understand what my values are, and how those are going to show up in my business, I’m going to be ping ponging all over the place. And that the effort that it takes to just be the ping pong ball, like good luck trying to get a client because we’re too busy recovering from ping ponging all over the place.


Yeah. Yeah, that just I mean, that’s exhausting. It is exhausting. Yeah, it’s, it’s exhausting. It’s exhausting. If you’re doing it in alignment with yourself. It’s deadly. Yeah, to do the exhausting work and go in the wrong direction.

Yeah, yeah. So that’s what you were saying a minute ago is you either stay in alignment with your values, and then try to do the things that that people tell you while you’re trying to stick, stay within your values? Or you go against your values and do exactly what they tell you to? And both are? Not fun, right?

One of them can get you to money, though. Faster, probably. Right. So there’s, there’s these rewards. And we have to decide, like, am I what am I willing to give up on my way to what I want a success? And if you’re taking on other people’s goals? Like, if you’re going after the goals that have been implanted in your mind versus the goals you’ve chosen for yourself? Like, there’s a lot there, I guess. Yeah. Right.

Yeah, that that can be Yeah. Yeah. And so it does, it does make it tough to try to discern, do I want this for me? Or do I want this? Because I’m supposed to want that.

Right? Yeah. And is this the way I want to go about it? Or is this just the way I’ve seen people go about it? Where does my decision making lie? Or does my responsibility for my business lie?

So can you think of examples in your business says, because I know you’ve had a few examples in your businesses were that were you struggled with that? Yeah, I think, you know, the financial goals are a place where I’ve struggled. So we all have that $100,000 goal for a long time, and then you hit it. And then you realize, that’s not what I thought it was, energetically, but also like, the, the word I want to get out is 250 is the 100. Right? So what you think is possible at 100 is going to be what 250 is, that’s been my felt experience. And that’s what I see over and over again, in businesses is like, the freedoms that I think that I’m going to unlock when I hit the magical six figures is actually more at around 2 to 250,000. Right, so there’s, there’s that side of it. And then there’s the disorientation that I felt once I got to, you know, at one point, I got to 400 for the year. And I was overworking and I felt kind of terrible. And then at another point, I was like, I think actually like I want to hit 300 a year I want that to be what matters. And then doing that consistently, then I’m like, well, what do I care about now? Like I’ve, I’ve taken the Legos that create a $300,000 – 350 year business, and I’ve moved them around in a bunch of different formations and created the same result. But now what because that’s not the fun part anymore. Now, what do I want to do what I want to care about what I want to play around with? Because I’m not actually interested in having a seven figure business, not in this not in this iteration of things. So I just think it’s kind of after. Yeah, I think it’s fun just to to be in that disorientation and then decide, okay, well, what would make me change my mind what, like, if I did want a seven figure business and messing around with like, Do I even want to have that goal? I don’t know. I’m still playing with it. Like what would what would I really care about? Because I LOVE what I’ve created. And I love living here and I like my life here. I like what I get to do here, but it was definitely you know, it seems like 10 years ago everyone was talking about getting to 100k. And now they’re all talking about getting to a million. But that’s just because that’s the new goal that’s out there. But what do you really want? What do I really want? Yeah, yeah. How do I want to live? Where do I like? Who do I want to donate money to? Where do I want my time to go? Yeah.

Yeah. Because I don’t know that enough people really answer the question of, yeah. Why do I want that? What am I going to do with that? Yeah. Do you want to manage people? Because if you don’t, don’t even build a business beyond 300k. Right. Like, think about the person who lives out there. Because also, a lot of us coaches get into this because we actually love coaching, and we want to do the work. And we still love one on one. And that’s a beautiful thing. And not everybody is here to be an online influencer education, edu-tainment creator, right. It’s not me. I’ve tried it. I’m like, I’m a coach through and through one on one coaching. I love it. Yeah, I love that. And, you know, and how do you get there except by experimenting?

Right, flailing around a little bit? Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah, 

there is no, there’s no certainty there. Right. The only reason I have the certainty I have right now is because of how much I have tried, how many people I have seen walk pads nearby mine. How many clients I’ve helped do similar things to what I’m doing. Like. I mean, how I think I’ve been in the business for like, 13 years and so I’ve tried all the things. I’ve done all the online business gyrations that I want to do and I’m getting really clear what I don’t want to do and what I do want to do. Yeah, having experimented a lot.


Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Cause you can’t really get that clarity from thinking about it. Right? You can get certainty without it. Right, like we could manufacture certainty about this is the way I’m going to go. Which I think as long as it lines up with your values and stuff, it’s going to work better. Yeah, but yeah, the data points from this vantage point versus five years ago are definitely different. I have more data to look at. Yeah, yeah. So yeah. So what is a way that you’re doing it? That is uniquely your way? I mean, is there a way that you’re doing it that’s uniquely your way? 

In terms of the way I make money as a life coach? Yeah, or just the way you’re doing? Your life in terms of your business and your business in terms of your life?

I think, now that I’ve moved the Lego pieces around enough times, and I’m at a space where entertaining myself with my business is less entertaining. Okay, you’re gonna have to expand on that. But go ahead. Okay. So it used to be like, I used to think it was really fun. Like, let’s write the book. Let’s, let’s start the podcast. Let’s start the second podcast. Let’s do this thing. Let’s try this kind of funnel. Well, what if I went all in with Facebook ads? What if like, just all the different things you can try. And so that was really fun. Okay, but then it was like, I’m kind of done doing that stuff. I’ve done a lot of that stuff. I have been selling coaching for 13 years. I know who wants to buy from me. I know how they like to buy from me, and I know what they like to buy from me. So what if I let myself quit all the things that don’t work and do what does? Like there are some very clear threads throughout the years of what has worked and what hasn’t. And if I and this is where this is that path of ease, feeling vulnerable, courageous, feeling like crap. If I allow myself to take the path of the greatest ease, where I’m being who I am, I have to feel courageous enough to quit doing all the things that I know everyone else around me is still doing. That may or may not be working for them. We don’t know, we can’t judge from the outside looking in. But that’s not working for me. Like can I let it be easy? Can I let myself quit all the things that aren’t creating the impact? Can I truly live by the 80/20 rule? And only do what works? Yeah, that’s what feels entertaining to me now. It’s terrifying and and feels hard even though it’s easy and makes me kind of want to vomit sometimes, like all the usual good things.

Yeah. So have the courage to do the things I want to do and not think the things that don’t work for me and receive the judgment from myself or other people. Yeah, I’ll be okay. Yeah. Yeah, let’s be clear. Let’s be honest. Yeah, no one cares what I do more than me. Yeah, exactly. And let it be okay. That it’s terrifying. Yeah.

That’s it. That’s the secret sauce right now. For me. Yeah, I love that, entertain, entertaining myself in my business. You have the best, like tweetable quotes, I swear. But it’s just like, oh, my gosh. They just make you think it’s like, exactly. Right. Here’s, what if I just take a break from what’s not me? I mean, what’s the worst that can happen?

I’ll keep getting the exact same results, but they’ll have way more time. That’s the worst that can happen. And way more enjoyment? Yes, potentially. Like, I mean, in my experience so far on this trip. I mean, you’ve been on that, that journey a lot longer than I have. But in my experience, I’m like, Oh, this is what they meant by it can be fun. It really can be fun. But we get it. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. If you, if you let yourself out of that contract to be who other people think you

should be. Right? Or to run the traffic you should be. Right. There’s like a very clear like, and we could all right, this job description if we want to, like life of life and job description of an online coach has good Instagram branding, sends a weekly email has a podcast, right? We could write out. And lots of us are doing all that stuff. But for how many of us? Is it creating the result that we actually expected it to? And what if we quit doing what doesn’t work? Like? What’s there now let’s, I keep having this thing I want to share, but it keeps leaving my brain because it’s so fresh for me. I can barely hang on to it. So maybe it’ll come 

back later. Okay, well, if I’m in the middle of a thought, please interrupt me.

So I’ll write it down. We can hear. Yeah, I mean, it’s kind of is said, when you were talking in the life and job description of a good online coach, it kind of sounds like the parallel of you know what people think a good mom is supposed to the role be? What that role should look like. And you know why so many working moms tend to struggle with their role, because they’re like, I want to work. I enjoy my job. And I want to be a mom, and I enjoy being the mom. And society’s telling me I can’t do both. And I can’t do both. At least I can’t do both. Well. So it’s sounds very similar to kind of that struggle.

Yeah. And that ability that we all have, and that we’re all trained into of seeing a role and stepping into it and finding some comfort there sometimes until we outgrow it or realize, Oh, this isn’t the role for me doesn’t align. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it’s comfortable because it’s comfortable. It’s more comfortable to do it, quote the right way. Then to do it your way.

Yeah, and I think this is coming up a lot lately. There’s a big difference between what’s familiar and what’s comfortable. Right. So we have these roles that we play, like, it’s very familiar for me to go home to my initial family and play the same role I’ve always played, but is it comfortable? That depends, right? So just notice the difference. Like I’m doing I’ll, oh, I just remembered the thing. Okay. It is easier for me to be consistent than to be inconsistent. And so and this is sort of the, what you learn how to do and you’re new in business as especially as an online coach. And there’s all these rules about what we should do. And everyone says, I need to have this, this, this and this, do it regularly build know like and trust. I took all that stuff on. I’ve done it for over 10 years. So it’s so easy for me to sit down and write 10 newsletters in 45 minutes and just have them lined up to go out and be consistent. It’s so easy for me to do that. It’s very hard. For me to think, well, what if I didn’t do that? Well, if the thing that I need isn’t consistency, what if the thing that’s going to grow me the most is being willing to give up the role of the person creating know, like, and trust for me to really show up and deliver what’s here for the people who like that are coming in? Oh, wow. So that was my, that’s my discomfort. I’m like, really? You want my email to not go out on Sunday? How does this work? I’m not saying it’s the way I’m saying. I think there’s something in there for me.  

What’s at stake?

Inconsistency people will forget i exists. What if I don’t do it at all? Right? Same fear. It’s like, intuitive eating, I can’t do that. I’ll end up 400 pounds, right. Like, if I take if I take the shackles off, and I have all the freedom in some way or another, I’ll ruin myself.  It will left to my own devices. And but I’m pretty sure that’s not true.

Yeah. Yeah, that’s something that I’ve really been experimenting a lot with over the last several months to is this idea of letting myself off the hook? Like, what if that was non negotiable? I’ve tried to make it non negotiable no matter what, I get to let myself off the hook. Yeah. Because what’s the worst that’s gonna happen? Oh, you know, my business was going to be ruined. And you know, I won’t show up or whatever. Like all the same.

Say, Who created the hook? And who’s on the other end of the hook? Like, yeah. 

Yeah, I started letting myself off the hook. And so far, I haven’t found any issues with this. So have you found any of this? Oh, yeah. Like what? Yeah, I just feel I feel more free. I feel more. I feel less burdened. I feel less constrained. I feel less. I feel more me. I feel less trapped, less stuck. Because if I get stuck, I’m like, Okay, what do I want to do?

Right. I’m a resourceful human being. Yeah, yeah. What’s next? Yeah. Those are all such amazing words. Yeah. And one thing that you kept asking me, when we, when you work out to me, it was like, but you’re the boss. What do you want to do? Like, oh, my gosh, I forgot. We weren’t raised as bosses.

I’m in charge. Yeah. Yeah. I think that’s actually how you put it like you’re in charge. Yeah, you are in charge. Yeah. Yeah. And so I mean, if I were to ask the question, you know, like, on your podcast, when I’m in charge. Now that I did write this down, I didn’t prepare a lot for this, this because I wanted to be free flowing conversation, because I just feel like so much more comes out. And when we plan, and I have loved this conversation, but it did write this down is like, because I remember when I was in corporate feeling this way, and thinking, oh my gosh, you know, if I’m ever the CEO, if I’m ever higher up than I think I’m ever gonna be, in this company, whatever company it was, that I was working for, at the time, I’m going to honor people’s strengths and believe in them no matter what, because that’s really who I was as a manager, or a life like, I had my peoples back no matter what. And I have never been one to give up easily. I’m very determined. But I’m especially that way when it comes to people. And that’s what I felt like, was so wrong with corporate not that that corporate is bad or wrong or anything, you know, people are people and they’re always doing the best they can. But I thought, you know, I am going to to be there for people and I’m going to support them no matter what I’m going to believe in what’s possible for them. Because that’s that is part of my values.

Yeah, that’s who you are. Yeah, you’ve got that. That’s like mama bear energy right there. Yeah, not gonna mess with my people. 

Yeah, I mean, I really was very protective of the people under me. I didn’t have like a ever have, like a ginormous team, but that they were like my top priority. And you know, I wanted to always have their back. Yeah. I didn’t always feel like that. From my leadership and Maybe that’s that’s why that was so strong for me.

I think that’s where our values, you know, there’s two ends of the spectrum our values standout on it’s those moments we feel in such great alignment that it’s like it’s just pouring out of us. It’s like what was what was being honored in you, that’s probably one of your top values. On the other end, it’s my value is getting stomped on and crashed and I am so pissed off. And I like want to, I want to like rage cry when I talk. Like that’s one of my core values is definitely being stepped on. And that’s the name of my podcast, “When I’m in Charge” that’ll be different came from one of those moments when I was in high school, I was 14 years old. I went on to the JV basketball team. And they didn’t create a C team. And there were 19 of us. And they even brought down people from varsity to play. So we had a bench of 26 people for games, JV games, we needed a C team. And I knew I was the coach couldn’t handle it. We weren’t learning anything we were just running. I was like, the coach couldn’t make the decision to have a C team. Because the administration wouldn’t either give them the money to have an extra coach or extra gym time, didn’t empower them to cut people. Everyone was worried about what the parents would think. And so here we all are left with a bunch of adults who couldn’t make the right decision. So that some people could have a great experience instead of everyone having a shitty experience. Oh, and I was just like, This is bullshit. So the next sorry if I’m swearing on a non swearing podcast, oh, you’re fine. So the next year I went and I was a cheerleader. And the coaching was impeccable. It was the best coaching experience I ever had in my life. I loved it. I went back to basketball the year after that, and it was back to smaller team size because so many people had quit. But it was it was definitely a This will show you who you are moment for me.

Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, that’s a good example of instead of maximizing, then, instead of maximizing a few you minimize everybody. 

Right? To be truly inclusive. We have to be exclusive. And it is uncomfortable, but it’s actual leadership.

Yeah, yeah. Oh, that’s a whole other topic. All their podcasts. 

Yeah. I’m writing it down the aisle because I love that. I need to find the who’s for that topic of conversation. To be inclusive, we have to be exclusive. Yeah, that’s a good one. Another one that takes courage.

Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, that’s it sounds like this podcast is coming down to I haven’t thought of a title yet. As we’re recording this, but I it definitely has to have courage in it. Yeah.


Yeah. You know, my favorite quote? Did I send you this mug? Did I have these when we work together? I don’t think so. The mug says courage feels like shit. Oh, that’s my it’s one of my favorites.

Yeah, I did not know that. Yeah, but that’s how you know you’re doing it. Right. Okay. All right. Love it. Well yeah, I was gonna say I don’t have a define throat. So normally I don’t, I generally don’t have a lot to save. I feel like I have a lot to say today. But now I’m out of things to say. All right. Do you have anything else you want to share?

I do I have one thing. Okay. So I put everything in my coaching business building brain into a course called Leisure Profit. And I priced it at $197. So it could be super accessible for coaches. And I’ll share the link with you so that you can share it here in case that would be helpful for anyone. And it’s really just how to learn how to love yourself as a business owner, how to learn how to love your clients, where they are and who they are. And learning how to love the process of showing up for them and of showing up for yourself to create the kind of business that you want to have. I’m proud of it. I love it. And I want people to have it.

Oh, I love that. I mean $197 That’s like, I know. Yeah. So if you had to encapsulate like, what in a sentence or two, what we need your profit does for coaches. Is it would it be how to what what is it? Where did the title come from Lead Your Profit? Sorry that Was that yeah, that came out of a time in my coaching practice where I had been working with a whole bunch of people who had learned how to sell, but had had not learned how to have money or manage money or be in charge of their businesses that had money in them. And so I saw this whole, like, it’s one thing to know how to sell and make sales. But if you don’t know what to do after that, that’s, that’s harmful to you, to your family, to your calendar and to your clients. So it’s really about, okay, you want to be out there, you want to sell coaching, you want to make money, you want to help people, like let’s really do that, though. So there is selling in there. But there’s also messaging, there’s what to do with your money. There’s how to create a calendar that works for you, as a coach, we kind of cover all the bases, because ultimately, what I want people to be able to do by leading their profit is take incredible care of themselves in their clients and run high integrity businesses.

Yeah, okay. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. So it’s really about how to be a leader in your business, rather than just showing up and doing all of the things in your business. So how can really lead a business that is profitable? And not only financially, but emotionally? And you know, if you think about the whole green movement in the world, it’s like running our green business from a mental and emotional standpoint.  Sustainable impact standpoint. Yeah, sustainable, businesses are really important for me. Yeah. I mean, my parents started a business in 1983. I was two years old. It’s still going today. Actually, I think I’m wrong. I think it started the year before I was born in 1980. So it’s like 40, some odd years old. And it’s important to run sustainable businesses, because that’s what grows our families and grows our communities, the better we get at running these businesses that we started, no matter how much of that clouding we have going on about our own self worth in the world, or how to be a coach, like this is how the world changes is we get small business owners profitable, and leading with their values. That changes everything.

Yeah, I love that. So I hope everybody who’s listening goes out. And not only gets that course for $197, but actually, yeah, goes does it and applies it and learns how to run a sustainable business, because I know that all of my clients are extremely interested in building and running sustainable businesses, because they don’t want to sacrifice themselves don’t want to sacrifice their values, don’t want to sacrifice their lives, you know, the lives that they have built to run a business. And so I think that’s really awesome that you’re doing that and doing that for such an accessible price. So yes, so much for all that you do for the coaching industry.

Thank you. And thank you love talking about money. All the money, thanks for Jill.  Yeah. All right. Well, thanks so much for being here. And I look forward to chatting again soon.

Yeah, sounds good. Thank you for having me. All right.

Awesome. That was such a fun conversation. I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did, I guess. Maybe when it’s live, it’s a lot more fun. I don’t know. But I would love to hear the takeaways. But I wanted to share a few of my favorite parts of this conversation and a few takeaways as a recap. So in case you missed them, you can go back and listen to them again. One of the ones it’s all made up. So what if we went through our lives believing that how do we know what’s possible or impossible? Why not just believe that we get to make it up? And how do you want to experience that? How do you want to explore that? How do you want to model that for whoever is watching you? And then another one, what’s going to make you successful is everything that you don’t like about yourself. Now, this is something that I have found recently, some of the liabilities that I thought I had actually turned out to be assets. So what if some of your liabilities are actually assets? What if you are actually an asset? What if you are way more valuable than you ever imagined? You could be?

Being you is what makes you stand out what limits have you experienced, that might make you even more valuable. Some of the experiences that we go through in life are tough, and they’re, you know, challenging. And they make us more of who we are, right? They make us stand out, they grow us, and they shape us. And they make us more valuable. So another one, I, the more I tap into who I am and walk that path, this is one from Caryn, there’s less resistance and more momentum, but also more courage is required. And I totally agree, being who I am is easier. And it can also be harder. So when you’re you, you at least have a solid foundation to build on. And when you can be you when you can have the courage to be you, You release the drag, when you have the courage to be you, you already have all the answers you need. Another one, we noticed, it takes a village to build a coaching business. And so a question that I’ll leave you with is who’s in your village? So I’d love to hear some of your favorites. I’d love to know what you took away from this episode. I love having conversations with other coaches. And it’s a special joy when I get to share some of those conversations with all of you. So I’ve orchestrated that for the entire month of June. So you don’t get to just listen to me, you get to listen to my conversations with four different coaches. And this was just the first of those conversations that I’m going to share with you in the month of June. So be sure to check in for a new conversation each week. 

What makes selling so hard? Selling is hard because there are too many rules. We think we want someone to give us the formula. The only problem is we have a problem with that formula. So the rules don’t apply to us. Those rules don’t work for us. We start thinking maybe I’m just not cut out for this. It’s so frustrating. It’s so discouraging. But maybe the problem is not you maybe the problem is just the rules at my 2022 Elevate You Retreat, we’re burning down the rules. We’re writing new rules, we’re writing rules that fit us to a tee. At the retreat, I’ll be coaching you I’ve got experts coming in to support you and help you with your selling process. You’ll have lots of opportunities to test and refine your selling process and get real constructive encouraging feedback before you take it out in use it. You’re gonna have lots of opportunities to change it up and just customize it truly to who you are and how you like to do things how you operate in the world. We’re doing all of this September 22 through the 27th in Nashville, Tennessee, Elevate You Retreat 2022 is all about selling without rules. So that selling can be easy. And if selling can be easy, maybe making money can be easy. So come to elevate retreat 2022 Elevate You elevate your selling, design your process with your rules that work for you so you can sell and feel good doing it by going to to claim your spot.